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Author Topic:   Sri Lankan union betrays Bata jobs struggle.
Negombo posted November 04, 2004 06:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Negombo     Edit Message
Sri Lankan union betrays Bata jobs struggle.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2004/nov2004/bata-n03.shtml

Nov 3 (wsws) The Commerce and Industrial Workers Union (CIWU) in Sri Lanka has betrayed the bitter three-month struggle of Bata shoe factory employees, allowing the Canadian-based multinational to retrench 146 workers and impose harsher working conditions.

Negombo posted November 04, 2004 06:43 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Negombo     Edit Message
There are few types of models on employer, employee relations.

- British model. Employees are well protected by Trade unions. Sometimes trade unions brings the entire business to bankrupcy. Sri Lanka, Australia, commonwealth countries follow this model.

- US model. Hire & fire. But still people prefer to migrate to US to work. Singapore follow this model.

- Japanese . Employees & employers are very loyal. They seldom fire. Most of the time whole family end up working in same company.

As an employee I prefer British model but looking at country's point US model is better.


What are your opinion?

Visva posted November 04, 2004 07:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Visva   Click Here to Email Visva     Edit Message
Negombo,may I offer you a suggestion even though I dont consider myself expert on anything

If you have a skill and you believe you are good at what you do,why dont you become a small business owner instead of being an employee?

For some,beign in business for themselves is very rewarding and of course some get burned out very quickly


you can find all the information you need on the internet

swamy posted November 04, 2004 09:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamy     Edit Message
my fitty cents:

British model will mostly work for under skilled, you will have a steady job with an average salary for a long time. Big brother will protect you during both good and bad times. Many not be good for dreamers.

US model will work well for high achievers. A highly skilled worker can become a CEO regardless from who you are. If you can dream it, you can achieve it really works there. If you can’t perform year after year, you are stuck at one place forever. Great to flush out ineffective employees and replace them with the fresh.

Japanese model is good if you want to become a slave for your life, if you are a foreigner, no chance of getting to the top. Could work great fo some.

Sri Lankan model: Great for people with no skills. You get hired if you know the right person. Basically if you work for the government, you get paid for doing nothing and stealing from the public money, bribing etc.. In the private sector, they make you work hard even through the weekend.

LTTE model: They wash your brain, and they own you. You learn to work for free for your own country (even if that doesn’t exist). You wear the suicide jacket and die smiling to increase the life span of your CEO. Great if you want to skip kindergarten and vanish from earty before A/L. This is the best model, basically if you are given the happyness and know nothing else, you have no worries. Join eelam.inc. if you like to kill your fellow Tamils for fun.

[This message has been edited by swamy (edited November 04, 2004).]

TCup posted November 04, 2004 10:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for TCup     Edit Message
Before I give my conclusion to what I believe is the best model, let me give my own two cents worth on each of these:

American model - efficient. If the employer can hire & fire without having to resort to large severance payments/backlash from unions, he or she can run an efficient organisation. The employer will always try to maximise profit (this is one of the fundamentals of micro-economics) and the employer will streamline his/her business as per the market situation. This is, however, not ideal for the employee who's job is very much dependant on the market (assuming he/she is a capabale worker for the job). The employee will have much less security than within the British system.

British model - security. The employer is forced to think twice about hiring someone. This acts as some sort of filter so that the organisation ensures the applicant is the right candidate for the job. Once the employee signs on the dotted line, it becomes expensive to get rid of him/her. Employment statistics may suffer due to this, since employers feel restrained.

Japanese model - not much to comment here, but it explains why it is so difficult to get a job in Japan.

I personally agree with Negombo. The British system, for me, is the most satisfactory, both for the employer (you aim to get the right people first shot, develop loyalty,...) and the employee (security = better standard of life).

Although I agree with most of swamy's comments, I disagree that the British model works best for unskilled people. I think that the British model calls for pre-qualification before getting the job, ie, you've got to be capable of doing the job.

Drwho1 posted November 04, 2004 12:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Drwho1     Edit Message
British system used to be secruity for skilled and middle class employees. It is not any more. We are living 21st century . I do not want sort of models you are talking.
How ever, I have to indicate that Difference between American Model and British Model. In America Model , if you could be top from bottom. But , British Model, You could not come to top from bottom. I think that some thing that depend on cultural and social factors.
In America, they used to be differents in Black(Negro) and white, but In American white soceity , they did not have class system as English (In England).
In England , they used to be class system, but still here, but Not like 30 years ago. Now ,English white person from working class soceity can be company owner. It was not possble in 30 years ago.
Trade unions were established against Middle Class and upper class, but now trade unions leaders are Middle Class, good example, New labour Party in UK.
Again, We are living 21st centuary. All were changed.

[This message has been edited by Drwho1 (edited November 26, 2004).]

swamy posted November 04, 2004 01:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamy     Edit Message
TCup
I made that comment for someone who is employed for a long time and did not keep up with the demanding skills.

I like US system, employee has the say on what he/she makes (based on your skills and market). A very good employee can make as high as 2 to 5 times what a comparable British employee can make. The risk and reward go hand in hand, if that is what you want. It is kind of like making money off savings than from the stock market.

wondermyfoot posted November 04, 2004 02:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for wondermyfoot   Click Here to Email wondermyfoot     Edit Message
Hi to all

What system you all are talking about and you ever consider that Srilanka you are talking about. In Srilanka no system works. Srilankan got systems, but it never flow. you know why? People put their moneybags (sand bags) and block it.

You can try anything you like but it never works in Srilanka. (American, Japanesse, English)

Make some effort to stop corruption then we all can talk about our wonderful system.
Do not say we need peace to stop all corruption. They both are very different matters.
If woman is hungry or homeless then do you think so she can become a prostitute? So everything (problems) will be solving it self. Do you really think so?

TCup posted November 04, 2004 03:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TCup     Edit Message
Swami,

I agree with you - the American system is indeed perfect if you are a risk taker. Do well, reap the rewards - but do poorly, and not only you but your family will suffer.

This is what the American system is lacking - security for the employee, and the lack of loyalty between employer and employee. This is something I consider very important.

Drwho, I think that in the British system, you have just as much potential to climb the corporate ladder as with the American system - the concepts are the same; if you work hard and show results, you get your rewards.

(On a side note, I'd just like to mention that I think the American work culture is all wrong. People spend too much time trying to make money, and too little time with the family, kids, and friends - the result are broken homes, neglected kids...broken society!!)

Burt1310 posted November 04, 2004 03:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Burt1310     Edit Message
What is corruption?

It is unethical behaviour practiced for personal gain.

Many might not agree with me but there are more bad apples in the basket than good ones. This is why I suggested that ethics should be brought into the class room as a subject at least to save the nezt generation.

Strict laws could work as a deterent but what happens if the enforcers of the law are corrupt.

[This message has been edited by Burt1310 (edited November 04, 2004).]

TCup posted November 04, 2004 03:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TCup     Edit Message
Good point, Burt.

But we have a problem in Sri Lanka. We have a dearth of quality people in Sri Lanka to run our organisations and institutions. And why do we have this problem? Because we don't pay our quality people enough. They all go abroad in search of a better life, and we are left with the rotten eggs. It is the same with doctors, engineers, managers...

What is the average salary of a 30 year old account with 5 years experiance in a private company? Rs 40,000? With that, he needs to send his kids to school, put food on the table, pay the rent - and then when he sees the rich spending Rs. 50,000 a night at the Blue Elephant in Colombo, of course he is tempted to make some money on the 'sly'. And this is the same with a policeman...only he is paid not even half of that, and he too has his kids to send to school, mouths to feed, and rent to pay.
Is it any surprise that there is corruption? Under the current conditions, I personaly am not surprised at all.

Start paying decent salaries in order to retain some quality professionals in the island.

Start with the teachers!

Burt1310 posted November 04, 2004 03:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Burt1310     Edit Message
TCup:
I do agree that there is no logic between the buying power of the rupee and the wages paid. Will increasing the salaries accross the board solve the problem? I dont think so because this would give rise to inflation still bringing down the rupee and skyroketing the prices of goods.
Sri Lanka has to think of ways to increase productivity thereby increasing the GDP and the strength of the rupee.
Having said that I have always felt that teachers were underpaid.

swamy posted November 04, 2004 04:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamy     Edit Message
“ but do poorly, and not only you but your family will suffer”.
I don’t think you suffer, your options become limited. This makes everyone concentrated doing a good job, that is the reason behind lot of American successes. Those who want to sweep the flow is not determined by the caste or politicians, but the choices ones make during this life.
The lack of loyalty hasn’t hurt employers or employees financially. I’d rather not be loyal and get paid less.
“(On a side note, I'd just like to mention that I think the American work culture is all wrong. People spend too much time trying to make money, and too little time with the family, kids, and friends - the result are broken homes, neglected kids...broken society!!)”
compared to what society? Americans pay more than anyone else for entertainment and vacations. Most American middle class is very conservative, follow their faith, spend enough time with kids and the family. You may be right with American working class.

wondermyfoot posted November 04, 2004 04:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for wondermyfoot   Click Here to Email wondermyfoot     Edit Message
I do agree with swamy here. >>I don’t think you suffer, your options become limited. This makes everyone concentrated doing a good job, that is the reason behind lot of American successes. Those who want to sweep the flow is not determined by the caste or politicians, but the choices ones make during this life. >>

It is a good point. If the option get limited, he/she will become more efficient to find that extra income by doing other job. Therefore, country’s productivity will go up because people want to work and earn money. Not like make money for doing favours or any other things.

TCup posted November 05, 2004 02:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for TCup     Edit Message
Some very valid points brought up here.

Burt - I am well aware of the effects of wgae increases on inflation. You are quite right to state that increasing wages across the board is not a long term solution. However, I do feel that our professionals are not remunerated enough compared to other segments of the bread-earners. I strongly feel that in order to avoid the brain-drain Sri Lanka is facing, we have to ensure that our professionals are remunerated to be on par with the business community. In Sri Lanka, the hard reality is that the business community are the people with money, and the professionals take home peanuts! These businesses have to be supported by competent professionals who are paid enough to reflect the standard of their services. This is not the case at the moment. Many decades ago, the professional was the best paid person in Sri Lanka, and with it came responsibility and respect. Now, the business community has all the money and respect.

Swami, my choice of word was not the best - I myself wazs suffering from a raging headache last night and typed my message a little too quickly I was in the US for a 3 week holiday in summer, of which I spent a few days with friends in NY. They were telling me a little about their lifestyle - how they wake up early, come home late, hardly have any holidays...they are part of the middle class. They were quite envious of the fact that I had taken 3 weeks off in summer, and am planning on taking a further 2 1/2 weeks in December to go back to Sri Lanka. Apparently this sort of holiday was vitually non-existant among the professionals in the US (especially among the younger people).

swamy posted November 05, 2004 08:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamy     Edit Message
It is generally accepted that people in US work hard vacations are less and their European counterparts are doing better. In fact, the hard work US works does benefits their employers the most than themselves. However that is for the general workforce at any level. If your capabilities are above the rest that you work with, your get much higher rewards.

Do you get 5 ½ weeks per year as vacations? Fantastic. US workers get about 10 holidays per year + about two weeks of paid vacation time. Some people like less vacation and more money so that they can live in a bigger house or drive an expensive sports car or buying an extra cabin to spend weekends. US is not for those who want to enjoy their lives taking vacations, it is for people who are willing to challenge themselves beyond their peers. It could be the only place where a smart person can migrate from a poor country and can expect to become a multi millionaire during their life time. Those who complain about hard work or lack of vacations here may not get there. The life in NY and CA is tough, however it is not the case in suburban USA.

I believe 40,000 Rs per month is a good salary in Sri Lanka. I think most teachers are paid under 20,000 Rs per month. People should try to maintain their earning to expense ratio. If you try to copy the expense pattern of someone with a load of cash, you become frustrated. The salary is determined by the market value. People should not rely on their employers to get paid high, if they don’t like what they get paid, they should do something about it.


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